Adepticon Gladiator question

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Postby Blackmoor » Mon Feb 08, 2010 11:51 am

Spacecurves wrote:
Generalissimo_Fred wrote:
Spacecurves wrote:
The heirphant can absolutely be killed in a few turns by a few different armies that come to mind.


Can you please enlighten me because right now the Hierophant has a 2+ / 3+ save. Unless there has been a rulechange that I haven't seen, then I would like to know your army that can drop this thing in a few turns, let alone one that theoretically can and still compete against 150+ KFF Orks.


I'm sure it will have the old 6+ invul, thats my point. If it keeps the 3+, then I'll have to agree with the doomsday profits :). Just wait until the Apoc FAQ, I'm sure reason will prevail. With the 6+ save, its fine.


I still would like to see the codex army that can beat it. You keep saying it can be beat, I would like to see an example of one that can also win 3 other games in a take-all-comers tounrnament.
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Postby moonshadow13 » Mon Feb 08, 2010 12:07 pm

He wasn't bad just out manuvered, he walked into my dire avengers and was slowed. as they did not die as expected. he was the one who moved into my guys as i bladestormed and dumped a bunch of shots into the guys in from of it wiping them off the board (surounding Eldrad's wave serpant). Sure both people might have made a mistake, but when you feel invincable and start slaughtering (well trying to at least) guys you can make them. Also i already had eldrad and his boys near it (in a wave serpant) and just wiped everything around it with massive amounts of gun fire.

However, that was not new codex rules and again i was just trying to shine some light on the big scarey bug. I go right at it with my 2+ to wound guns and weapons everytime. You don't need alot of shots just some to soften it up some. Then you just use your "i only need 2s to wound weapons) in the assualt phase. takes all that need for multiple low ap/high str weapons out of the picture. Its amazing how when i wound your 16 times how many of those will come up 1s. You cant doom it so its all about good rools or making the percetiles of sucesses vs. failures.

Still you have to admit that is pretty cool sight to see (especially if your the one killing it)
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Postby Spacecurves » Mon Feb 08, 2010 1:34 pm

Blackmoor wrote:
Spacecurves wrote:
Generalissimo_Fred wrote:
Spacecurves wrote:
The heirphant can absolutely be killed in a few turns by a few different armies that come to mind.


Can you please enlighten me because right now the Hierophant has a 2+ / 3+ save. Unless there has been a rulechange that I haven't seen, then I would like to know your army that can drop this thing in a few turns, let alone one that theoretically can and still compete against 150+ KFF Orks.


I'm sure it will have the old 6+ invul, thats my point. If it keeps the 3+, then I'll have to agree with the doomsday profits :). Just wait until the Apoc FAQ, I'm sure reason will prevail. With the 6+ save, its fine.


I still would like to see the codex army that can beat it. You keep saying it can be beat, I would like to see an example of one that can also win 3 other games in a take-all-comers tounrnament.


There's no dark secret, just apply lascannons to its face until it stops moving. IG and space marines can muster the necessary firepower without too much trouble.

For example: 3 vendettas will do 3 wounds to it each turn, a couple medusas would add another two, maybe a lascannon here and there in a squad, and you are looking at a fairly reliable turn 2 kill. Remember its 1250 pts! You can get a lot of firepower in most any codex for 1250 points!

Also if it fires back, its going to take too long to reach you, so it basically has to take the beating as it approaches. Maybe it will get lucky and run down a screening rhino or chimera, but bottom line is if you keep your head, you can handle it just fine.

Also fliers would recreate the King Kong vs. bi-planes scene, and we all know how that ends.
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Postby muwhe » Mon Feb 08, 2010 2:26 pm

Hierophant has a 2+ / 3+ save. Unless there has been a rulechange

The final FAQ including the IA stuff will be posted today. So barring any signficant update from GW or FW we should be all set.

The Hierophant has the Tyranid Psychic power "Warp Field."

Pg. 62 in the new codex lists the current Tyranid Psychic powers.
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Postby muwhe » Mon Feb 08, 2010 2:38 pm

Spacecurves ... Your the voice of reason. I knew a "codex marine" army finished near the top... *cough* .. and you faced the vaunted "Reaver" to boot!

I'm guessing most people that faced it just crapped their pants .. and pissed themselves... the game then was over before it started.

Some former Gladiator Champion .. once said to me ..you got to play the mission.
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Postby CaptKaruthors » Mon Feb 08, 2010 2:57 pm

Just the sheer amount of time one has to put in to "out think" the thinkers has made me abandon the gladiator now. People take it waaaay too seriously...like their life hangs in the balance or something. Christ, the amount of time in preparation for this event....you'd think the players would have a coaching staff to help them. Personally, the Gladiator has lost it's luster with me, and I will be amused to watch the stressed looks on some of the peoples faces when their hopes are dashed. Meanwhile I'll be sipping my vodka cranberry mumbling something about failing...LOL. :lol:
The vet sarge says “OK, screw this!” and turns on his Powerfist again, but the guardsmen get a sudden surge of ape like strength and they bring the marine down in a hail of fists, feet, and feces.
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Postby Generalissimo_Fred » Mon Feb 08, 2010 3:51 pm

Damn it Hank. In the end you are right, again.
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Postby Janthkin » Mon Feb 08, 2010 5:29 pm

CaptKaruthors wrote:Just the sheer amount of time one has to put in to "out think" the thinkers has made me abandon the gladiator now. People take it waaaay too seriously...like their life hangs in the balance or something. Christ, the amount of time in preparation for this event....you'd think the players would have a coaching staff to help them. Personally, the Gladiator has lost it's luster with me, and I will be amused to watch the stressed looks on some of the peoples faces when their hopes are dashed. Meanwhile I'll be sipping my vodka cranberry mumbling something about failing...LOL. :lol:

Mostly, I take my Championship list, and add one silly FW model I'd like to paint (and leave out whatever I need to, to make the points work).

I gave up winning the Gladiator quite a few years ago, when I couldn't roll a single "3" on 12d6 (rerolling doubles) to get Siren...in 2 out of the 3 games. Since then, it's been a lot more amusing.
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Postby CaptKaruthors » Tue Feb 09, 2010 3:27 pm

Wow. That's sort of like the time I failed 5 out of 6 morale checks in a gladiator game over the course of 2 turns. :)
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Postby tcmd » Sun Feb 14, 2010 6:03 pm

If I read the new addendum to the INAT FAQ correctly the Hierophant has no invulnerable save whatever. That goes a long way toward addressing the issue. It still concerns me enought that I've considered changing my gladiator list specifically because of it, but it's definitely manageable depending on deployment.

I'd like to see scenarios that force it to deploy out of shooting range, or that involve nightfight in the early 2-3 rounds to limit it a bit more. As a matter of fact, just give me first turn and night fight on round one and I'm good.
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Postby Green Blow Fly » Sun Feb 14, 2010 6:18 pm

CaptKaruthors wrote:Just the sheer amount of time one has to put in to "out think" the thinkers has made me abandon the gladiator now. People take it waaaay too seriously...like their life hangs in the balance or something. Christ, the amount of time in preparation for this event....you'd think the players would have a coaching staff to help them. Personally, the Gladiator has lost it's luster with me, and I will be amused to watch the stressed looks on some of the peoples faces when their hopes are dashed. Meanwhile I'll be sipping my vodka cranberry mumbling something about failing...LOL. :lol:


I have hire a team from the pentagon & wall street to help synergize my strategy for hte gladiator. And FW is releasing a top secret warmachine just in time for me to use only!!!

G
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Postby Inquisitor_Malice » Sun Feb 14, 2010 10:48 pm

Check out the Gladiator primer missions that are posted on www.adepticon.org.
- Greg
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Postby tcmd » Mon Feb 15, 2010 11:43 am

I printed out all 6 scenarios last night and studied them in detail. I think those may be the best written set of scenarios I've ever seen.

I think we can assume that scenario 1(AKA screw the superheavy monstrous models) will make it through. Every year has one of those, but this one is tougher than usual. I like this one--A+

Scenario 2 is interesting, but I feel it's the least balanced of the 6 scenarios. It seems not so much to punish a particular unbalanced build as to reward Guard and grav tanks. Sure the idea of slowing down the running hth horde and rushing rhinos is cool, but I see this one being more a luck of the draw scenario. Draw the wrong opponent, and even the balanced army is going to be screwed. But I think my biggest issue is kill points as primary victory condition, move that to secondary or tertiary and I'd up the grade to C+ or B- respectively. C--

Scenario 3 is balanced. The Warp Flux rule provides an interesting twist with a strong risk/reward balance. B+

Scenario 4: my favorite. Cold start is very cool. Not only does it screw flyers, it gives you at least a head start on hierophants and titans. I DO like the modified kill points and I think they are well placed as secondary victory condition. A++.

Scenario 5 is a close runner up for my favorite. Unfortunate Deployment is quirky and cool. It provides almost infinite ways to force the opponent to adapt his normal style of play, and no matter what you normally field you are going to have to adapt. The guy who uses this the most creatively is going to dominate. Pushback is interesting and I think it will often result in people not taking full advantage of Unfortunate Deployment. Disruption also provides a really interesting dynamic. A++

Scenario 6 is also genious. Tunnels and Disinformation provide a beautiful compliment to one another. Should provide both teams interesting advantages and disadvatages, another case of the advantage going heavily to the smarter/more adaptable player. Also complements the set of objectives and the deployment rules for the scenario well. A+

I was strongly considering bringing a warhound, but not any more. I assume 1 and 4 are definitely going to make the cut and probably with little modification. Unless I got paired with a 6 year old playing a HTH tau army I can't imagine wining BOTH those scenarios with a titan or hierophant chewing up points in my list. And some of the others could make using the big guys challenging against the right opponnent.

Kudos to the writers.
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Postby Green Blow Fly » Mon Feb 15, 2010 4:31 pm

Damn I was planning on bringing a Bio Titan and now ya go and take away my INV save!!! What is up with that??? :evil:

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Postby muwhe » Mon Feb 15, 2010 4:52 pm

All we can do is translate what we have to work with Greenie..

on the plus side you do gain the advantages of lash whips and talons... :D
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