Helm's Deep....................?

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Should we include Elves at Helm's Deep?

Yes
9
75%
No
3
25%
 
Total votes : 12

Postby BrentS » Fri Oct 26, 2007 4:06 pm

I voted for Yes to Elves but I'm in favor of have Erkenbrand and Gamling form the relief force.... sory of a Hybrid approach.

In the book, didn't the Ents come to Helms Deep as well?
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Postby knitemare » Fri Oct 26, 2007 4:14 pm

BrentS wrote:I voted for Yes to Elves but I'm in favor of have Erkenbrand and Gamling form the relief force.... sory of a Hybrid approach.

In the book, didn't the Ents come to Helms Deep as well?


No, I just checked.

Aragorn
Legolas
Gimli
Eomer
Theoden
Erkenbrand
Rohan Swordmen on foot came later, that was it

No mention of Ents
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Postby JLeong » Fri Oct 26, 2007 4:16 pm

I like the idea of a hybrid game as well. In the books, not ents exactly, but huorns came to helm's deep. They are represented in the TT extended edition by the huge forest that moves to the fortress. In fact, at least to my understanding, they are alot like trees. They destroyed the uruk hai, but did not "fight" alongside the defenders.
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Postby BrentS » Fri Oct 26, 2007 6:08 pm

JLeong wrote:I like the idea of a hybrid game as well. In the books, not ents exactly, but huorns came to helm's deep. They are represented in the TT extended edition by the huge forest that moves to the fortress. In fact, at least to my understanding, they are alot like trees. They destroyed the uruk hai, but did not "fight" alongside the defenders.


Huorns... that's what I was thinking.
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Postby JLeong » Sat Oct 27, 2007 10:08 pm

Hey folks, I picked up a box of Dunland warriors through the Geneva Commons tournament today. I was worried that we wouldn't have any of these wildmen for our Helm's Deep game. I'm wondering if anyone plans on getting any of them or if I should try to get my hands on another box. Although they're not there in the film, we gravitate towards a hybrid game, so I figured these would be fun to include.

Also: I know there has been a postponement of the Osgiliath game some of us are taking part in. Do you guys think that we could keep the Helm's Deep game in December? For me, January and February are the hardest months of the year in every way possible :lol: and I'd really like to be able to be at the Helm's Deep event. What do you guys think?
Thanks,
Josh
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Postby BrentS » Sun Oct 28, 2007 7:55 pm

I might be able to play on December 1st. I'd expect that December 8th would be out.

However, given my family commitments I can't even guarantee that.
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Postby knitemare » Sun Oct 28, 2007 8:31 pm

If you pick a date I can get a real answer to you about whether or not I can show up. If I go to my wife with, "Hey, some weekend in December, I'm going to have plans...so don't make any," she'll have a fit. If I have a solid date, she'll be cool with it and will plan to do something with the kids accordingly.
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Postby JLeong » Sun Oct 28, 2007 9:13 pm

ok, it seems as if we want elves at helm's deep. I'll change the poll to see which date folks find it easier to get to the bunker on. Dec 1st or Dec 8th
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Postby JLeong » Sun Oct 28, 2007 9:14 pm

Ok, I don't think I can edit the poll, so I'll create a thread especially for setting the date.
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Postby knitemare » Sun Oct 28, 2007 10:13 pm

Excellent, I'll vote as soon as I see it. That still doesn't settle what armies are going to be necessary and who has them. Also, there are obviously supposed to be a TON of Uruks. Aside from the respawning each turn, how many should be on the battlefield to start?
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Postby prion2001 » Sun Oct 28, 2007 10:53 pm

OK. I'm setting up a new post in the Army List Thread so we can start seeing what models we need for Helm's Deep.

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Postby febber » Mon Oct 29, 2007 12:29 pm

For game terms you are better off with cavalry as the relieving force since the game version of the Uruk hai are more powerful than Tolkien envisioned, and the assaulting army at Helms Deep in the book was composed of regular orcs and Dunlendings in addition to Uruk-hai.

If you wanted to follow the book to some degree you could use a lot of different warriors for evil:

UH in heavy armor
UH scouts (as skirmishers)
Orcs (lots of 'em), but no Morannon orcs or Mordor Uruks
Wild men of Dunland
Armed Dunlendings
Warg Riders (not that many), after the second battle of the Fords of Isen they were used as raiders more than in combat.

For good, while the Haldir's Elves appearance was controversial, having a few of them gives the siege defenders more flexibility. Don't forget the Royal Guard -- since Theoden was at the fortress virtually the entire contingent would have been also.

We have used house rules to create Huorns. F5 S5 D7 2A 2W C7 -- 40 points. Movement is 3 inches per turn, but nothing is difficult terrain for them. They worked out well. They aren't going to run down anything but the idea is to pin the orcs between them and the relief army to create orc jelly.
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Postby JLeong » Mon Oct 29, 2007 4:52 pm

Uruk scouts will be at HD, at least I think. they come in the legions of the white hand box- one of my uruk army building blocks. We will also have armored dunlandings. Can't forget orcs! Everyone loves orc warriors!
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Postby LongFang » Mon Oct 29, 2007 7:27 pm

I have not voted, because I am on the fence on this issue. On one hand, Elves were not present at Helms Deep, yet on the other - it's a self-imposed limitation. Is it going to be a "pure" recreation of Helms Deep? Or is it going to be more abstract and allow for more varied forces, while keeping the primary participants true?
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Postby thorhak » Tue Oct 30, 2007 3:00 pm

Yeah. Someone else's stomach churns at the thought of Elves at Helm's Deep! :twisted:
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