LotR Adepticon Feedback

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LotR Adepticon Feedback

Postby prion2001 » Mon Apr 22, 2013 12:10 pm

First, a huge thanks to everyone in the LotR community who attended Adepticon and helped and/or played in our events. I don't want to miss anyone so I won't list everyone who helped but you guys know who you are. We had an incredible crew who stayed around after the Thursday night Mt. Doom event to move and setup terrain for our other tournaments in another hall. Plus people's help as tournament staff, demo game staff, bringing terrain and packing up. I really can't thank you all enough. Yout make doing this much less work and much more fun.

Now, on to the critiques. Let us know what you liked and/or did not like about the events this year. Schedule, days, scenarios, terrain, formats, points, etc.


"It is a strange fate that we should suffer so much fear and doubt over so small a thing." Boromir
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Re: LotR Adepticon Feedback

Postby BrentS » Mon Apr 22, 2013 12:24 pm

I'll go first (unless someone ninja's me while I'm typing)

I loved having three events - that let me play in two and still run one!

Although I was the biggest proponent of going back to the "old school" team format of player separately (but side by side)with your teammate, I felt like I missed out on the team's playing together. Just didn't get as much "team" out of the event this style. I know why it was changed this year but I'll place my vote now for the teammed approach again in the future.

I appreciate the way the Team and Champs used different scenarios so that the event wasn't a repitition of the same scenarios each day. While I don't love all the book scenarios it was nice to get a chance to play them all. Even with the wonky deployment rules, it didn't seem to effect the timing of the games. Having said that (and I know I face this every year) its always hard to balance scenario choice so as to not favor one type of army build vs another (ie. small elite vs large horde). The warbands rules seem to normalize this already but there is still some scenarios that will always favor hordes (King of the Hill, Domination) and others that will favor elites (Lords of Battle). So its important to balance them across all the events.

I thought the 2 hour rounds was just about perfect. I had two games that basically when the full time but both of those were due to games being extended by the lack of a 1-2 on the dice roll.

I would definitely vote if we keep three events, find a way to keep them in the same room! Moving terrain was a pain.

All in all, it was one of the most enjoyable tournament weekends I had. I had 6 great games and you can't ask for more than that!
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Re: LotR Adepticon Feedback

Postby BostonNazgul » Mon Apr 22, 2013 12:41 pm

This will all be in reference to the team event as I did not play in the singles.

1. Day: Friday: Saturday or friday are always the fun peek days

2. Schedule: 9:00 start time was nice so it wasn't too early. I would like to see at least 4 games. Personally, 3 games can be a bit of a let down at a convention as big as adepticon. Keeping it all in 1 day is important too because people want to play in other games or systems etc.

3. Terrain: Classy as always, but some stuff is starting to see some age. We always talk about fixing stuff and replacing things so hopefully life wont get in the way too much and we can make some head way for next year.

4. Scenarios: Random 1 or 2 game ending die rolls are lame. I would like to see, "roll a die, the game continues that many turns"

the 2nd scenario seemed overly confusing for what it actually was. Just some wording was odd.

I enjoyed not having the "kill the enemy leader" victory point clause in every scenario. It made for a more objective oriented situation.

5. Team Format: Originally the Rings events were going to just be the team event, so the team format, but single style games, were kinda designed to be the best of both worlds. in the end we locked up 2 events so I think going back to a team format for the team games, with both players on the same table, 2v2 match-ups.

We will see how B3 goes for the 750 points, but I think bumping up to at least a 1000pt team event, 500 each, played on 4x6 would be awesome.

That may relate to more of a "next years" thread, so maybe we can start one of those!
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Re: LotR Adepticon Feedback

Postby BrentS » Mon Apr 22, 2013 1:00 pm

BostonNazgul wrote: Personally, 3 games can be a bit of a let down at a convention as big as adepticon. Keeping it all in 1 day is important too because people want to play in other games or systems etc.

Forgot about that one... but I agree... would like to see 4 games again (in some capacity). The top two finishing teams in Battle points just missed playing each other and a 4th round would have let those two teams beat each other senseless.
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Re: LotR Adepticon Feedback

Postby griffen127 » Mon Apr 22, 2013 5:26 pm

I had a great time playing on Friday and Saturday, Thursday would have been fun if I wasn't asleep on my feet. I would like to see the games we played either changed a little or more thought. It seemed that the first day was favored towards smaller armies and the second was better for hordes. A mix up between the 2 would be great. I want to see bigger games. What do you have to lose? Lets face facts getting “new” players in is almost never going to happen. Most of us have been playing for what 5-10 years ish? We have large armies and can make points easy. So lets try it out fire it up make it larger. The team tourney should be back to a team play game. If not why not run 2 champ tournies?

A team game that is 750 a guy, played on a 4x6 would be amazing. If people are scared of 100+ lists that people can't play in time then make a model cap. 75 figs a player team cap at 150. I would be happy to start another post and debate any and all people about this. I am positive that we can all be happy with a larger game, and come to an agreement that we would all be happy with.

All and all I had an amazing time. Great job to all to u tourney runners out there.

P.S. Thanks for the snacks who ever u are.
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Re: LotR Adepticon Feedback

Postby BostonNazgul » Mon Apr 22, 2013 11:11 pm

thanks, I didnt have time to make a homemade batch of cookies, maybe next time though.
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Re: LotR Adepticon Feedback

Postby febber » Thu May 23, 2013 4:34 pm

1. Days – Friday/Saturday schedule requires me to miss 2 days of work. I’d really prefer a Sat/Sun schedule. I know it's a tradition, but is there a reason we can't move the days?

2. Location – Can we move it to Florida? :lol: Or at least put a moratorium on screwups with air travel on the day before? :roll: I feel like I'm jinxed trying to get to Chicago for the event.

3. Terrain – some of the tables were really bland, surprising, given all the terrain we have. More importantly, a couple were not as balanced in setup as they could have been. Do the people setting up know the scenarios? If not, can they at least be reminded to set up terrain symmetrically so that no player has a better path to the middle than the other? This is a simple and obvious problem, although admittedly less of an issue with the new deployment rules.

4. Format – I don’t care strongly either way on the team thing. I didn’t have to carry Brent this year, he scored the same battle points as I did! :lol: (Which means with painting he was our highest scorer, so he carried me). The separate play actually rewards strong teams of players but it doesn’t seem like a team event. As far as number of rounds, I’ve lived through the past where we got pairings so late that it impacted our ability to finish a game. Four rounds does provide a better event (3 rd events don’t necessary select the best player/team, just the one(s) with the luckiest pairings). But it’s pointless to try 4 rounds if the games lose 30 minutes of effective game time due to delayed pairings followed by setup/deployment issues.

5. Scenarios, victory conditions – my comments on these are going to be on another thread as they deal primarily with the game as it has been mangled by the Hobbit/Warband rules, scenarios and victory conditions. Bottom line, though, if you want a decent tournament, you need to depart significantly from the published scenarios, deployment rules and victory conditions, on occasion, or at least tweak them for balance's sake. Lining up 2 armies in the middle of the board and going at it is UKGTing this event, and I have no interest in that style of play. It’s gutting tactical skill and emphasizing list-building, and favors some army builds over others.

6. Bonus points – these were the biggest flaw of the weekend. They were handled differently in both events but were not handled particularly well in either. If you are going to use them, use conditions that are carefully and thoughtfully selected for the context of the specific scenario they are assigned to and provide equal possibility for points in each game for a variety of armies and a variety of opponents. As for Championships, the use of cards has been taken to its logical excess and is hindering balance within the game. And repeating the same card in the same event should never happen. That’s statistically indefensible and needs to be eliminated. Unless you don’t want them to be a reward for tactically sound play, but just a random chaos variable for battle points.

7. Scoring – the checklist for sportsmanship has become almost meaningless. I understand the intent was to depart from the nearly standardless GW event scores (and I was one of the people who advocated for some form of normalization way back), but the championships on Saturday proved that they don’t really mean much. Perhaps they can be supplemented with an ordinal opponent ranking that adds up to half of the total points awarded for sportsmanship.

One other comment about sportsmanship. It has long been considered in the informal circuit a common courtesy to provide your opponent a copy of your army list, not just for review, but for reference within the game, and preferably one that has the specific stats readily available. In 6 games over the weekend, only two opponents (not surprisingly the most experienced opponents I played) did so. Not having such a list for my opponents requires me to spend time creating a surrogate partial list for marking hero stats, and occasionally looking up stats for a rare figure. I'd greatly appreciate if some comment could be placed in the rules for future years requesting that players do that.
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