New rules...

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Re: New rules...

Postby old coast » Sat Dec 01, 2012 4:55 pm

Are you guys worried about the new rules bogging the down game in a tournament setting? Its been brought up to me...I wont have mine til Tuesday....so I haven't seen it myself...I like alot of what I am seeing, but might we see some sort of abridged version for events?....from what I see WYSIWYG..is going to be mandatory...thoughts?
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Re: New rules...

Postby BrentS » Sat Dec 01, 2012 5:40 pm

old coast wrote:Are you guys worried about the new rules bogging the down game in a tournament setting? Its been brought up to me...I wont have mine til Tuesday....so I haven't seen it myself...I like alot of what I am seeing, but might we see some sort of abridged version for events?....from what I see WYSIWYG..is going to be mandatory...thoughts?



I'm worried that the fight phase will get bogged down a bit... especially until everyone gets comfortable with it. The new rules, by all accounts, seem to be great for small scenario based skirmishes. Time will tell how it translates to tournament settings.

I do think with the "special" rules for weapons, WYSIWYG will have to be mandatory for tournament play. It should create some interesting conversion opportunities.
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Re: New rules...

Postby Monty » Sat Dec 01, 2012 7:54 pm

I was worried the books that came out earlier in the year would be obsolete. I saw a GW article online that mentioned the authors waiting for an old elven army to battle the trolls, or something like that. Makes me wonder if the model profiles will be in a sourcebook like "The Free Peoples". It looks like we are getting an addition to our current game and not a separate game altogether. Whew!! So far nobody is saying the rules are too different. Still have priority, might will and fate, and model format. Just maybe more to do with them. Hoping Santa will bring me some stuff.
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Re: New rules...

Postby old coast » Sat Dec 01, 2012 10:29 pm

Can someone clear up the new weapon rules...I am reading some stuff on TLA that is very disturbing , Swords are -1 to your Fight?? WTF?...9 out of 10 models are wielding swords and do so in the books and films with the exception of Dwarves, making special rules for Thorins Co. and just blanketing then over the whole universe is not cool..
please enlighten me...I had started building my team army but stop until this weapon stuff is sorted.. I am reading the Bows are now ever worse?? (according some posters)
come on! :?
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Re: New rules...

Postby BrentS » Sat Dec 01, 2012 11:12 pm

old coast wrote:Can someone clear up the new weapon rules...I am reading some stuff on TLA that is very disturbing , Swords are -1 to your Fight?? WTF?...9 out of 10 models are wielding swords and do so in the books and films with the exception of Dwarves, making special rules for Thorins Co. and just blanketing then over the whole universe is not cool..
please enlighten me...I had started building my team army but stop until this weapon stuff is sorted.. I am reading the Bows are now ever worse?? (according some posters)
come on! :?


As I understand it, all those "special" rules for models are optional during the fight. Each of the "beneficial" special rule comes with a penality for using it. Or you can just use it a standard weapon.

From what I can tell, Bows now suffer a -1 penalty to hit if the model moves at all. I also heard that volley fire is gone.

Also, big change with Spear support... apparently, spears can still add an attack to the combat but now do so at the spear armed models FV and STR (no more cheap orcs behind Uruks). But unarmored elves in the 2nd rank will be popular.
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Re: New rules...

Postby Guardian of Ecthelion » Sat Dec 01, 2012 11:34 pm

@old coast-- You can choose to use the sword at minus 1 to fight but then it is plus 1 to wound just like the old 2 handed weapon.
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Re: New rules...

Postby Lordgoober » Sun Dec 02, 2012 12:45 am

yeah, move and fire is at -1.

One new thing for heroic shoots, the hero who calls a heroic shoot to jump the shooting phase does NOT need a missile weapon to be able to call it for the Warriors around him.

Heroic Accuracy for the Reroll of the ITW rolls isn't just for him, it's for all the warriors around. MUCH more useful than originally thought since ITW rolls now have different levels of what's needed to bypass the cover.

Yep. Volley fire as we knew it for bows = gone. Good Riddance.

Oooh. Had the Hobbit rules been in effect for BBB, what happened to me in that battle against the fellowship might not have happened the way it did as the old version of Call Blinding Light is now the heroically channeled version. The standard version is now a 1 turn spell.
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Re: New rules...

Postby BostonNazgul » Mon Dec 03, 2012 12:32 pm

I bet Brent had a great sunday, he probably sat home, curled up with his new rule book and watched the walking dead mid season finale. right brent? they have AMC in puerto rico?
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Re: New rules...

Postby old coast » Tue Dec 04, 2012 8:18 pm

Whats up with all the misinformation on rules...?? :?

Reading the new wargear section 67-74 I am no longer worried about the rules bogging down the game.
why? the special attacks seem pretty clean and well written it seems great care was done differentiating
between the Duel roll ( the roll to win the fight) and your fight score...I think this was confused in some of the early reports
there no "-1 to win the fight for swords" hand weapons remain unchanged with the exception of elected special strikes.
two handed weapons have not changed as far as I can tell
spear use and support have now changed for the better, (no more multiple spear supports on one model)

special strikes usefulness remains to be seen but overall I am really liking what I am seeing here

where I am disappointed with some of the scale issues I am seeing with the starter models (other new models in the book have alot of promise
(elven cav, another radagast, new eagles) overall the rules are getting a thumbs up..this is at first read..
hopefully I am not missing anything glaringly..
Last edited by old coast on Wed Dec 05, 2012 12:22 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: New rules...

Postby BrentS » Tue Dec 04, 2012 8:57 pm

old coast wrote:Whats up with all the misinformation on rules...?? :?


Still don't have any copy of the rules or book... Hopefully tomorrow night I'll be back in Chicago and can get my starter set.
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Re: New rules...

Postby old coast » Tue Dec 04, 2012 11:38 pm

BrentS wrote:
old coast wrote:Whats up with all the misinformation on rules...?? :?


Still don't have any copy of the rules or book... Hopefully tomorrow night I'll be back in Chicago and can get my starter set.


Yeah, I didnt mean you or the guys here..we were just repeating what were reading on TLA , and Warseer,
I know I relayed a bunch of info that's turned out to be incorrect......
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Re: New rules...

Postby Smeagol » Wed Dec 05, 2012 12:11 am

Misinformation, rumour mongering and panic attacks are normal faire for every new Tolkien related release. I've learned to filter most of it out. Reading comprehension is a challenge for most people and when combined with rumour vines means very little comes across as accurate.
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Re: New rules...

Postby rustin » Wed Dec 05, 2012 12:51 am

Honestly this is how I see it: The old books that came out this year aren't obsolete. If I'm playing with characters from LOTR, im going to continue to use the LOTR SBG rules. If I'm playing The Hobbit: An Unexpected Jourmey SBG, I'll use the new rules. Maybe ill change my mind later if i really like the new rules, but it seems to make the most sense in my head to treat these as 2 separate games. They may have taken place in the same universe, but the books and therefore the movies have completely different tones and I think I like the idea of the games being different as well. That's the best thing about taking part in a hobby that gives us so much creative control over how we engage with it, is it not? FREEDOM! Anyone agree/disagree?
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Re: New rules...

Postby Smeagol » Wed Dec 05, 2012 1:51 am

The Hobbit SBG is then next generation of the game. I started with The Two Towers version just before it became The Return of the King version and then it became LotR SBG which we have all enjoyed playing.

The "new" rules are just the LotR SBG rules with updates and changes to keep pace with the movies that are now being released. It's not a different game any more than WHFB or WH40K are when compared to their earlier releases.

Personally I can't see too many people sticking to the older rules particularly when you consider that new players will not be using them. I'm already seeing an uptick in interest from people that have never played LotR SBG.
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Re: New rules...

Postby JLeong » Wed Dec 05, 2012 3:42 am

I'm quite glad to her that people are seeing new interest! This is definitely an exciting time for us all.
I really don't see people trying to use the old rules. Folks were generally resistant to the warbands rules, but (from Whqt I can tell) they have largely gotten over it. This is certainly only a long overdue tweak to our system. I wouldn't go so far as to call this a new game. War of the Ring was a different story. That is truly an entirely new way to use LotR miniatures. The Hobbit just gives us some new options.


As for misinformation, I'd like one thing cleared up: (I am at Valpo, and my tiny rule book is back in IL ATM), the sword "feint" special rule-- this allows a reroll of 1s when attempting to wound at the cost of -D3 to Fight Value, correct? Did I read it/am I remembering it incorrectly?
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