Aegis Defense Line, beating a dead horse?

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Aegis Defense Line, beating a dead horse?

Postby Lord Krungharr » Thu Mar 14, 2013 11:23 am

In the last little tournament I played in, my opponent argued that the Aegis Defense Line only grants cover saves to those 'behind' the wall, that is only on the one side without the little Aquila symbols. He also said it should only be on the 1 side because 'why would I pay points for something that grants the enemy cover?"...

I argued against that as it follows the rules for 'walls and barricades', and those grant cover from either side, depending on the firing model's perspective of course. I granted that if his firing models are up against the wall, or even 2" back can see through the slits or put their guns on the ledge to not permit me to get cover whilst advancing, even if I'm only 2" away from the wall (kinda like coherency with the wall, and reflecting the rules bit about charging models being within 2" of another in base contact with the wall being engaged).

----The TO agreed with me, but what are other people's reads on this topic?

That opponent also had 2 Predators behind the wall, whose lascannon sponsons were definitely below the top edge, though the turret was way above it for clear LOS. In that case, since the tank was right up against the wall, I didn't demand cover saves from the sponsons, not sure about slit visibility and distance to the wall from the actual sponson-barrels.

----But would it be correct to determine covered-LOS for separate weapons on the same vehicle, or even in a squad of Infantry with different weapons? Or if from one weapon's/model's perspective the shooting avoids cover does the whole vehicle/unit then avoid cover as well?
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Re: Aegis Defense Line, beating a dead horse?

Postby seahawk » Thu Mar 14, 2013 2:04 pm

It's TLOS for a reason.

If the target model is partially obscured by the wall, then they get the cover save. If the predator's guns can't see they can't shoot. Really, the process is very simple and I'm still astounded that people continue to somehow get it wrong.


'why would I pay points for something that grants the enemy cover?"...
Because "he done f****d up enough that now you get the benefit instead of him."


----But would it be correct to determine covered-LOS for separate weapons on the same vehicle, or even in a squad of Infantry with different weapons? Or if from one weapon's/model's perspective the shooting avoids cover does the whole vehicle/unit then avoid cover as well?
Vehicles and infantry work differently. You check cover from each weapon on the vehicle, so some could give cover, some not. Page 72.

If the target model's body is obscured from even a single model in a non-vehicle unit, then it gets cover from all the unit's shots. Page 18.

In your examples:
- If he's entirely up against the defense line, you get no cover.
- If he has any models that are any amount of inches away from the defense line and your model is obscured by the wall, you get cover.
- You'd always get cover from the sponson weapons of a Predator if it's shooting through a defense line, and sometimes the turret, depending on location.
"Serious sport has nothing to do with fair play. It is bound up with hatred, jealously, boastfulness, disregard of all rules and sadistic pleasure in witnessing violence. In other words, it is war, minus the shooting." - George Orwell
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